00:00 Frost lessons to limit your freeze loss. That's what we're talking about in this episode of Extreme Ag Cutting the curve. 00:06 Welcome to Extreme ags Cutting the Curve podcast, where real farmers share real insights and real results to help you improve your farming operation. 00:15 This episode of Cutting the Curve is brought to you by cloth where machines aren't just made, they're made for more 00:22 with a wide range of tractors, combines, forger and hay tools. Cloth is a family business just as driven, demanding, 00:29 and dedicated as yours. Go to cloth.com and start cutting your curve with their cutting edge equipment. 00:35 And now here's your host, Damien Mason. Hey there. Welcome to another fantastic episode of Extreme Acts. 00:41 Cutting the curve. We got a topic that you're gonna like if you are like everybody probably is when it comes to farming. 00:47 Gonna jump the gun a little bit. You're gonna get excited. You wanna get out there, you wanna be the first one to roll, 00:51 not just because you're competing with the neighbors, but also because we know that getting out early oftentimes equates to bigger yields. 00:58 Matt Miles brought this subject up and they group extreme ag text stream this week. He wanted to get out early, you know, it's March 01:06 and he thinks it's time to roll on some soybeans. He got 'em planted, they emerged, and then he had a frost. So we're talking about 01:12 how you can limit the freeze loss on your farm. Cold survivability, maximizing yield from early planted stuff. 01:20 Lee Lubert is an almost an expert on this because basically it frost until sometime around mid-August up where he is in Gregory, South Dakota. 01:28 And then Kelly Garrett has actually hosted Matt Miles when they was concerned about this frost, 01:34 and they had a big dialogue about it. And of course, Matt's the one that brought the topic up. So I've got Matt Miles, Kelly Garrett, Lee Lubers here. 01:40 Matt, tell us about the problem and what you learned by visiting Kelly on humidity and frost. 01:46 Yeah, so what I'm doing is I'm, I'm, we're pushing, of course, we always push the window, but I'm trying to figure out in a 10 year period 01:54 or a five year period, how far can we go? How far can we push it? When is it gonna affect yield, 02:01 and when are we gonna have adverse weather to completely take the crop out? Uh, last year, uh, this is my third year doing this. 02:07 The first year, everything, all the stars lined up. It was perfect last year. It got below freezing for probably seven 02:14 or eight hours and it killed 'em all. So I was 50 50. I planted these beans on February 26th, around two weeks ago, we got back to back scattered frost, 02:26 but it wasn't anything to be concerned about. So I knew this frost that was coming was gonna be a relatively, 02:31 what we call here, a killing frost. So when I was out there at Kelly's, you know, we were, that one of our discussions were, you know, 02:39 why do you get so much? I, we, you know, our frost is different. Well, the humidity I looked the day of the Frost event, 02:47 my humidity was 89, Kelly's was 51 mm-Hmm. So we formed that dew, you know, during the night, what we call dew or moisture. 02:55 And then it's kind of like a bridge. You know, a bridge will freeze before the ground wheel because it's in the air. 03:01 Well, that plant, those leaves, those buds, you know, are gonna do the same thing. So Kelly 03:07 and I talked about the difference in the Frost course. They'll tell you I'm a wearer all the time. Then on the way home, I got to talking 03:13 to 'em on the question text. I knew Lee had had a lot of experience with with this, and, and he, he and Kelly both. 03:20 And, you know, we come up as a group, you know, Mike Evans was involved. I don't mean know how many of us are on that question text, 03:26 but, you know, I was talking to the guys. That's what's so cool about Extreme Act, is I can get information from all different parts 03:33 of the country on things that they, we don't even experience unless we're crazy enough to plant beans in February. 03:38 Mm-Hmm. Then I'm looking more in kind of the things that they are. So we come up with a combination of the shield. 03:45 Uh, we ran two ounces of shield, two ounces of mega grow, and one ounce of fortified stimulant from, uh, 03:50 Corteva bi biologicals. What's gonna be a follow up? Hold on. Yeah. Fortified stem. And we're gonna have a follow up of the bio 04:00 for advance that should help these beans along from there, put it out there. I was out there at daylight when the frost got there. 04:09 It lasted about an hour of ice on the plants, maybe something like that. I said, I'm not going back until Thursday morning, 48 hours. 04:19 I went back Wednesday night, I couldn't stand it. Looked with my truck lights and I, and surprisingly they looked pretty good. 04:24 Went back out there yesterday afternoon, I had to hunt to find a bean that was dead, and I got populations on one of 'em. 04:31 9 7, 1 of 'em 115. And that's another reason like, well, we need have our population study. 04:39 I planted 160, I got 97 up, so, and I planted 160 and got 115 up. So that's where I kind of have to put, push that population. 04:50 Sometimes if I'd have planted 120, I, I would've barely had a stand. I want to talk, uh, obviously Lee, I, 04:58 I joked it doesn't really frost until August 15th. It's more like August 1st up there in Gregory, South Dakota. But anyway, um, I'm going to ask the, 05:06 before I get into all of the strategy, I'm gonna go and throw the easy one out there. The critic, the skeptic. 05:12 The person that's listening to this is saying, well, why the hell do you push it? Why not? Just you gotta do all that work, all that, all 05:18 that personal stress. Plus you're using these extra products. Why not just wait another month? 05:24 And I think that's the, the easy answer. You know, soybeans don't get frosted in my part of the world. 05:29 If you wait until Memorial Day to plant, why, why push it? And anyone untake that question? I guess Kelly 05:36 To me, uh, beans are a very mathematical plant. Every day that they're up and growing, it's, uh, helps you. And every three days they're gonna put another note on. 05:47 So the earlier I can get 'em up, the more days under that sun, I can get 'em, the more nodes I'm gonna put on. Do you agree with that, Lee? 05:54 That's the reason that we push it. Absolutely. Yeah. That's the reason we push it now. And now like, you know, like Matt is pushing it relative to 06:04 what the normal, uh, practices are in his part of the country. Lee and I push it for the 06:08 normal practices are part of the country. Yeah. Most expensive words in agriculture is this is the way we've always done it. 06:14 So I applaud Matt and Lee, uh, for going out and trying to do better. Because again, you're just trying to put more notes on Lee 06:21 and I subscribed to the same weather service. He's telling me I'm gonna have a frost on May 10th. So that isn't even pushing it. That's not even pushing 06:29 It. Yeah. May Yeah. If, if now Grant, we're recording this. I, it's important to point out, we are recording this. 06:34 Today is March 22nd. Just so you understand. So we're about a month, almost exactly four weeks that Matt's soybeans have been in the ground. 06:42 And I think this is the neat part that you're talking about. It's, it's kind of relative in the delta of Arkansas 06:48 and southeast Arkansas planting. February 26th might be the equivalent to maybe where I am or you are Kelly of planting, uh, like April 1st. 06:57 You, you know, I mean, it's kind of that far, right? Yeah. April 1st, March 25th. I agree. I I really agree. Matt. Just obviously Matt's 700 miles south. 07:05 Yeah. And then to, to Lee, it'd be, uh, you know, probably April 15th or something like this, I'm guessing. But here, here's what I'm wondering. 07:13 Um, you said more days under sun. I want Lee to address this where Matt is. It's, I think it's, I want to get out 07:23 before the weather gets to where it's Africa hot. But where you are, you got a whole bunch of daylight because you're way up there north 07:31 and you know that the frost, it might be may, I guess I'm still saying what's the hurry? Because there's a chance at losing it 07:42 and you've gotta use these amendments. So aren't you still, wouldn't you still be better off to just go ahead and not push the envelope? 07:50 10 bushels? Is it 10 bushel about That 10 bushels at at $12? Figure that out. Is it 10 bushels Lee? 08:00 Uh, it's not even going out early. I mean, we can experience, well, like Kelly said, late season frost. 08:09 I mean, uh, I know, uh, Chad, he talks about the Easter freeze. I know I'm not saying it the right way like he does, 08:17 but we'll experience mother day freezes Memorial Day freezes. Uh, I mean, we've seen 08:25 fro light frost into the first week of June. What do we do? Wait till we're too late to really even be out there to start. 08:32 Doesn't make sense. I mean, it's called farm and you gotta roll the dice. Uh, mother nature changes on you. Big patterns. 08:40 You can go from unseasonably, be unseasonably warm, unseasonably cold, you gotta deal with it. It's cold farm. And so you go out 08:48 and you plant when the conditions are right. We don't look at a calendar. We look at conditions. So, uh, the great thing about some 08:55 of the things we're doing in furrow, and we can do foliar like we're gonna talk about today, we can minimize that risk 09:02 because that means we're maximizing our window. That's what we're trying to do. All right. So maximizing the window. 09:09 He, he's always good for sound bites. We don't look at a calendar, we look at conditions. I'm writing that down because that's, that's 09:16 sound soundbite worthy stuff. Um, obviously you say that the 10 bushels, Matt, and you say you're gonna push it a little bit within 09:26 reason you didn't go out and plant January, because I mean, so what's the white, what's, I guess help me out then if, while we're gonna stick with 09:34 that quote before we talk about strategy and products. We look at calendar, we don't look at calendar, we look at conditions. 09:40 What conditions do you look at, Matt? Well, it's not always February 26th for you. Sometimes it's a week earlier 09:45 now, sometimes it's a week later than that. Right. My target planning date is gonna be the last week of March. 09:50 That's where I found it. Maximizes Yields March Mar. Yeah. Last week of March. What I'm trying to do with this is just for, 09:59 for general information. How early is too early? I'm trying to find that date that absolutely you tell a guy, do not try this. 10:07 I had 15 calls before I planted my beans of people that had already planted theirs. Mm-Hmm. I mean, I had one guy call me 10:13 and he said, uh, so and so planted his beans. I said, really? And he said, yeah. He said, if Matt Miles can do it, he is gonna do it. 10:19 And I'm like, don't, I'm, I was the guy saying, don't try this at home. Yeah. You know, like you see on the commercials when they're 10:24 jumping stuff and light herself on fire. It's a research project to get into the February, March 16th of March 25th is my sweet spot to get the 10 bushels. 10:36 Okay. So versus Versus late April to first half of May. All right. We don't look at calendar. We look at conditions. 10:44 That's that's true. To a point. Kelly, what's your thought on that? Because it's gonna be in early spring, 10:49 and that's a reason why I love this topic and why we're gonna be putting it out right now. There's gonna be a lot of people tempted 10:55 to get out earlier than they probably ever have. Uh, like you said, there's the four. There's, there's the ones that are going to do 11:02 what they've always done because that's what dad did and grandpa did. They aren't, they aren't extreme ag followers. 11:08 The one, the people that are listening to this are the kind, they're gonna say, Hey, I, I want that. 11:12 I want that 10 bushels. And so they're gonna be tempted, especially this year, his generally speaking, 11:18 the whole country is ahead of pace. Um, you know, uh, 10 ground temperature and, and ambient temperature wise, right? 11:26 The whole country is ahead of pace right now. But again, according to the forecast that Lee and I subscribed to today or yesterday, it changed. 11:35 And now it's gonna get cold and it's gonna stay cold and wet for a prolonged period of time. He even used the word, the sentence 11:42 or the phrase in the email, winter is back so much like, you know, have you ever heard of, uh, what Mike Tyson says? 11:49 Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face. So Lee's Lee's, uh, statement of, 11:55 we don't look at a calendar, we look at conditions is true until it gets too late. 12:00 And then farmers aren't gonna care and they're gonna go put the crop in the ground. Mm-Hmm. Because all of a sudden they're gonna look at the 12:05 calendar and it's gonna be quote unquote too late. And I'm not judging 'em 'cause I'm guilty of it myself. I'm gonna push, I'm gonna push the envelope anyway 12:13 'cause I'm not gonna look at the calendar. And that's why the products that we're gonna talk about and the practices we're gonna talk about are something you 12:19 need to educate yourself on. Especially like this year where I think everybody believes it's gonna be in early spring, and I think it's gonna be a late spring. 12:27 So you need to know how to protect yourself when you roll the dice. I like it Lee, by the way, is it, 12:32 I I call it a fall spring when my buddies in northeast Indiana are telling me they've never seen anything like this. 12:37 And they're playing golf, uh, first week of February, you know, super Bowl's on and they're playing golf or you know, basically I'm like, I said, you know this, 12:46 you know, this won't last. I mean, it's kind of like you, you know, this can't be real and it, and it can't be. 12:51 So what's your strategy gonna be, Lee? We don't look at Cal mr. We don't look at calendar. We look at conditions. What are you gonna do? 12:58 What conditions are you looking for? And what are you going to do? You're not in the field yet. Obviously it's March 22nd. 13:04 You're not like Matt 'cause you're in a different part of the world. What's, what are you gonna do? 13:08 Uh, we're gonna run, uh, an inferral program because, uh, with pgs and biologicals, we're able to fortify the plant 13:19 as it's coming out the ground. That's gonna make it a lot hardier to handle stresses. And, uh, like Kelly, he uses accomplished Max 13:28 and that's been great luck for him. We're using some other products, uh, also, and you want to start that plan out, right? 13:37 That's critical. So we can get, we can get an earlier jump, uh, the plant. I mean, we're fortifying it right out 13:43 of the gate from germination. That's very important. You said Lee, before we hit the record button that, and I wrote down because I, I write down, 13:52 basically I wanna be like the scribe. I wanna come up to Gregory, just follow you around with my pen and paper and just write down smart stuff 13:58 that you say, I'm gonna do that one of these days. Um, you said an in furrow program is the key to cold survivability. 14:06 I wrote that down. Um, yeah. Uh, it, it gives you the one thing, the, the way we talk about in extreme ag is the systems approach. 14:15 So we're doing it, we're getting multiple shots at this. We can do it, uh, via in furrow programs. 14:22 And then we also have foliar products. We can come in and apply before we hear the frost is coming to even fortify it more 14:31 so we can take the colder temps that the other guys can't, To the person that doesn't have an in 14:37 furrow program. Go ahead, Kelly. Well, you, you talk about going up there and following Lee around. I learn something every time I listen to Lee. 14:45 Chad and I went up into North Dakota and spoke with Lee one time and he was talking to Jason Sly in the back of my pickup. 14:50 And, and Chad looked at me because the conversation was over our head and I said, yes, Lee Louvers is playing chess 14:56 and the rest of us are playing checkers. You know, and, and I I would also like to add, you know, when we're talking about stress 15:02 and Frost Lee has two seasons winter in July. Matt has two seasons summer in January. So these are the two best people 15:11 to talk about stress on a plan. Actually, I, I know that I get, if you're listening to this, obviously we've, we've all gotten to a level of, 15:18 uh, relatability and, and friendliness. Matt sometimes picks on me because the group extreme Ag Techs that I'm fortunate 15:26 to be on, sometimes unfortunate to be on, they bring up topics and after they, after they hash out, 'cause they share the information, I say, Hey, 15:34 this spawned an idea for a podcast that I think more people should hear than just you guys on this text. 15:39 And Matt has picked on me before for saying, every time we talk about something, you try and make us into a podcast. 15:44 And Exactly. Because this is good enough information that should be shared with others. Honestly, my first answer was, well, 15:53 if you wanna avoid Frost stop planning so damn early. Now we know that there's the fluke, fluke and freak moments. Yep. You know, like Kelly talks about, it's not uncommon 16:01 where all of us live, especially, you know, it's beautiful sometime in April and then my neighbors are all out planting 16:08 and then we get that cold snap the first week of May. It's happened a number of times and it's like, oh, this is gonna kill stuff off. 16:14 And, and it doesn't just last for one night. It's like four nights in a row and, and all that. So I think there's a great topic, the person 16:20 that doesn't have an in, in furrow program, 'cause we discussed once before, only like maybe 10% of the farmers 16:28 have infra capability or do a lot of infra stuff at the time of planting. Are they screwed? Are they just gonna get frosted? 16:34 What, what's the answer? Go around the horn here. Uh, Matt, you're probably the best one. 'cause you don't do inro on all your stuff. 16:41 I don't, and this may sound arrogant, but if they don't have infer, they probably should wait till it's, till it's worn. 16:47 Uh, one thing I've seen by, by, you know, advice I've gotten from these two guys on the website and others too, we're building that root mass 16:56 before the bean even comes out of the ground. You know, the coline there leaves would just be pushing outta the ground. 17:02 We've already got, we've already got, uh, feeder roots, you know, and if you look at the videos, I've got pictures of them, you know, 17:09 and I even went to where I didn't, so I cut my infer completely off. Now those beans are gonna come up, 17:15 but they're gonna be probably 20% of the stand with about 60% of the root mass. So which would you rather? How, you know? 17:25 And so that's, that's very important in my opinion. And I'm not a, you know, I resisted infra forever. Mm-Hmm. But if you're gonna go out there in any kind 17:34 of stressful situation now corn's different. You don't wanna put corn under your stress. You know, I learned that the hard way. 17:40 I tried to plant the corn and the beans early. I finally gave up on the corn. I don't even have a corn plot this year early 17:45 because I know it's gonna yield less than the, than than corn is planted at opportune time. Beans on the other hand, I, I was talking 17:53 to a guy about this this morning auction. I think the more you, you beat 'em up, the better they get because that they'll stack their nodes. 18:02 You know, they get, they get punched in the mouth enough that it, it toughens 'em up. 18:07 Now that's just, that's no, there's no science behind that really. But you've seen people try to burn 'em with Cobra, you know, 18:13 roll 'em when they come up. All these different things. I sprayed some with Paraquat last year just to see if they die. 18:19 You know, just different stuff like that to make that beam before reproductive stage, stacking nodes 18:27 and, and, and get tough. That's just my opinion. That's not a scientist's opinion by the Way we're gonna hear from the other guys. But 18:33 it's my personal opinions. I've sat through enough of these farmer meetings where they talk about doing stuff to semi kill the soybeans. 18:40 'cause then somehow they, they survive and come back better. I'm almost worried that we are going to create a, 18:46 a kudzu type of a soybean where it's all of a sudden they take over and let all those can you believe at a time they had to worry about growing more of these. 18:53 We can't kill 'em now anyway. Is that a real concern, Lee? Uh, we feel mother nature throws 19:00 enough at us in the season. We really don't wanna stress our crop anymore then it's already going through. 19:07 So we're big on the stress mitigation factor. And uh, the one thing you always hear in the extreme Ag Group, the one word that we preach is being proactive. 19:18 And that's where, for guys that don't have a Inferral program, not a problem. There are foliar ways you can alleviate stress and that's, 19:27 but you gotta be proactive when you hear the forecast is, is sounding tough. Uh, you wanna, you wanna go out, spend a few bucks, 19:35 it's not a big investment to minimize your potential loss because that's going to make you money 19:41 or it can save your crop. Alright, So let's go through the programs you guys use for those that do have the in furrow. 19:47 Uh, Matt gave his if either Lee or Kelly wanna go through what yours looks like on in Furrow. 19:53 And then we'll go through and tell the people that are listening that don't have in furrow, because I think that's the, the meat of this. 19:57 Before we do that, I want to take a quick little commercial break for our friends. Nature's Nature's, Tommy Roach, all the gang down there. 20:04 I was at their booth at Commodity Classic. We had two great panels. Nature's is awesome. They also paid for people to go to Commodity Classic 20:10 who are members of Extreme Ag. So I encourage you to become a member for the seven $50 you're gonna spend to become a member. 20:16 You know what, the last two years in a row, and I'm guessing they might do it again. Nature's paid for your admission into Commodity Classic. 20:22 So it's a great, it's a great deal also. You can learn stuff. You come to our panels in the booth. Nature's is focused on providing sustainable farming 20:28 solutions and helping maintain crop genetic potential for your generation and future generations. High quality liquid fertilizers that are powered 20:37 by nature's bio K target specific periods of influence throughout the growing season via precision placement techniques. 20:43 As a means to mitigate plant stress, which is what we're talking about right now. Enhance your crop yield 20:46 and most importantly, boost your farms. ROI. Very important, in a year like this, we're talking about depressed farm commodity prices. 20:54 Um, for the in Furrow program, what's it look like, Kelly or Lee? We run accomplished Max 21:02 and we will run Mega Grow in Furrow. Uh, it's a grower standard practice on both crops, corn and soybeans for us on every acre, uh, whether it's heat, 21:12 stress or cold stress, the accomplished max has helped us. You know, that's Anson product. It's derived from seaweed. 21:19 And the way that Scott Lay and Steve Sexton described it to me was that if you imagine seaweed is one 21:25 of the fastest growing plants on the face of the Earth, when the tide comes in, it's very cold, wet, and salty. When the tide goes out, it's very hot and dry. 21:35 But yet seaweed has learned how to, um, advance and grow and, and, and do very well. 21:42 And, and some of the most harshest environments that a plant can live on, on the face of the Earth. And now they've got those properties in Accomplish Maxs. 21:51 When they told me all this, I thought, yeah, yeah, this is snake oil. And now I've seen it work on my farm in the heat 21:56 stress and the cold stress. I believe Steve told me that he thought the plant could survive down to a couple hours at 28 degrees. 22:05 And, uh, we've tried it on beans and I'm pretty comfortable with it. Okay, so accomplish Max. 22:10 Uh, and then the Bio Forge Advanced is a Corteva biologicals product, formerly stole Corteva 22:16 Biologicals Bio Forge Advanced. It goes in the furrow as well. No, That's a f That's a f that's a F layer. 22:22 Yeah. And then Shield, shield X, which is a integrated ag solutions product. It's a foliar, Yes. Okay. So the 22:28 only thing that we're putting in, okay, Lee's nodding his head. Do you put Commax in furrow? 22:33 Uh, we are gonna work with it some this year 'cause Kelly's had such good luck with it. Uh, we are a staunch advocate of, uh, 22:42 applying the mega grow in furrow, uh, get that plant started off right. Uh, we've been using a product called Vertex in furrow 22:50 that's more for, uh, phosphorous solubility. Uh, we actually like, uh, using, uh, the fulvic acid that Kelly, uh, works with. 23:02 Uh, that's been good luck too. That has a positive impact on the plant. So we're setting the stage early and, uh, that's the thing. 23:12 Get it out of the gate. Get the plant going. That that's the thing. Uh, and I know we're in tougher economic times 23:18 and guys are listening to this going, man, I don't wanna spend the money. Well, I guess my advice is, if you're gonna set the stage 23:26 for a subpar crop, that's, I guarantee that's what you're gonna raise. So, uh, we're all advocates of, uh, planning 23:33 and trying to set the stage for a good crop no matter what mother nature's gonna throw at us. I like it. I'm not gonna write that down. 23:42 That sounds, that sounds a little harsh. If you wanna set the stage for a bad crop, you're gonna get a bad crop. 23:47 Uh, that that does, that sounds a little bit, that sounds, that sounds a little almost like, uh, like an old nun like, 23:53 uh, that just is disciplining a kid or something. Matt, you talked about roots. Um, you spoke about you'd rather have, I I'm, 24:00 I'm gonna make sure I, I'm not quoting you incorrectly. I think you said, I don't mind that I lost population. 'cause you planted enough. You used it. 24:08 You, you put, you overpopulated knowing you're gonna have some struggle because of the experiment going 24:13 out February 25th. But what you pointed out was, yeah, you had death loss. That's fine. You've accounted for that. 24:19 You said, I'll take the death loss in the reduced population because the roots. Is that what I is, am I, am I eScribing 24:27 that thought accurately? Uh, you got me. Uh, uh, not, I, I don't guess I really, the, the root system, I said I in furrow 24:37 because we're building that bigger root system in, in the harsh conditions. You know, that's important to me, 24:44 the infer when I get later into the season and, and I don't plan by the calendar either as much as I plan on like a 15 day forecast. 24:51 But when I get later in the season and, and, and the situation gets more friendly, user friendly, then I may back off on that one thing. 25:00 We have trouble getting an ROIA hundred percent of the time on a hundred percent of our acres of, of infer on soybeans. 25:08 We, we can on corn. But this year I've gotta run a product called Velum, which is a nide, uh, nom side 25:15 for root knot nematodes on a lot of these acres I'm planning this year that's gonna allow me to go back to the drawing board 25:21 and use some of these products that they're getting results out of. So I'll have all kind of private plots. 25:26 Yeah, I say private that, that I'm doing on my own. Yeah. Just to see if I'm missing a boat. 25:32 That's one thing you don't ever need to do is say infra, I don't work for me and quit. 25:37 You know, if, if if infer don't work for me the two years, maybe the third, fourth, fifth year does. 25:44 So we've always gotta keep an open mind, um, and, and, and continue to try these things. So back to the root thing, I guess what I kind 25:54 of thought I heard is that are, are getting really good roots, uh, a key to cold survivability. 26:02 Is that maybe, I mean, is it, what's the key to cold survivability? We've talked about, you know, a few different things here. 26:09 Is it, is it the, the products that you're putting down help get better roots? That, that means that plant can 26:14 take a little bit more stress? What's the help me out here? Well, I mean, with a bigger root system, 26:20 it's always better. You know, the plant's gonna be stronger. He is gonna be able to defend himself against things. 26:26 Just like you got a big guy and a and a and a little small guy, you know, the big guy's gonna be able 26:32 to do a lot more things than the small guy is. And the same thing with the roots, in my opinion. There's more nutrient uptake. 26:38 You've got d more sites for the nutrients to get in, the stress mitigators. All the different positive things you're doing to 26:44 that plant have a better, it's like having a four-lane versus a two-lane road. Hey, Lee, since you're a smaller guy and, 26:52 and Matt's a really big guy, did you just take that as a microaggression? The way he spoke positively about being big 26:58 and then spoke in a derogatory manner about smaller people? Because I took that maybe 27:02 that he was sort of trying to intimidate you. I I refer to myself as the Rodney Dangerfield of the group. 27:08 I get no respect. So, you know, it's not the first time You just got called, you just got called a chess player among checker players. 27:15 I'd say that there's a tremendous amount of respect. Respect, yeah. They, they, they, They do give a dog a bone every now and then, you know? 27:20 Yeah. They, they gimme some cred. Okay. To the person that doesn't have in, first off, I wanna know the person that doesn't have in furrow, 27:27 you said the one answer was maybe you shouldn't push the envelope, but then Lee said, no, you can still get out early 27:34 and, and, and grab that extra yield premium by going out early. It's just, you're gonna have to be more dialed into the 27:42 forecast and then you go out and treat afterward. Uh, answer me on, on those methodologies. Somebody, Kelly, you go first. You're nodding your head 27:52 Yes. You know, if, if the crop comes up and, and see you're, you're earlier question. Th this kind of speaks to that. 27:59 You said, why do it if you have this risk? Well, this isn't a risk that's gonna happen every year. What happened to Matt isn't gonna happen every year. 28:06 Uh, I've had it, I've had years where I didn't have to worry about it years when I did. So the, the juice is worth the squeeze 28:12 because of the extra bushels. And one year out of three, two years out of five, you can't predict it. 28:18 You're, you maybe are gonna push it a little hard because we can't predict the weather. And then at that time, you know, we're gonna go out, 28:25 you know, potentially with some, um, mega grow. If you don't have any inferral, uh, shield X, uh, terramar, uh, you know, products like that, you know, 28:35 what Shield X does, uh, I've learned from Lee is it strengthens the cell walls. You know, your root system question, the bigger, 28:42 healthier root system that we have, the healthier, stronger plant we have. And if we have a healthier, stronger plant, 28:48 just like a healthier, stronger human, we can, we can adapt or we can take more stress. 28:53 And you know, that the foliar application like Matt made, you know, Lee, we talked about it in the text, it needs 29:00 to be done at least 48 hours prior to the event. So the plant can digest the product, metabolize the product. Uh, shield X is a very common product for us to use, uh, 29:10 when we go out and do things like that. But like I say, Terramar would also use, uh, there's a few other products. 29:16 The Bio Forge advanced product, you know, uh, a cocktail of those products. Matts beans look really good. I think they're gonna survive. 29:24 Uh, well, uh, are you out of the woods yet on, on Frost and the Delta? Uh, when, when we're talking almost the end of March, 29:32 you're probably outta the woods, aren't you? Well, I mean, according to Kelly's new weather report, maybe not, you know. 29:37 Um, but we're out, we're, we are out of the traditional frost window that would harm anything for on a, on a normal 10 year span. 29:46 Not saying like Kelly said that it, that it couldn't happen. But when I went out there and there was, you know, all the, 29:51 the new growth was good, you know, the bud was good in the top. I thought I'm, I've got it now. 29:57 And then of course we're getting rain and it'd be in, in the high forties tonight with, with a lot of moisture. 30:03 So it's not just the cold weather that I may lose a little just from this next week's worth of weather. 30:09 That's not frost scare, but it's just gonna be bad weather. Uh, Lee, 30:16 I just heard from Kelly that if you don't have in fro, you can still absolutely push the envelope and you can get out there early in a year like this. 30:22 It looks like a lot of guys are gonna be doing that and gals are gonna be doing that. They're gonna be getting out. 30:26 They're going like, Hey man, this tennis spring. And then when there's the risk, as Kelly pointed out, if you're talking in second week of May, 30:32 getting a hard frost killing frost, that's not like, oh boy, you should have known better. I mean, you should have known better than to plant stuff, 30:41 uh, you know, third week of April because a May 10th frost, a killing frost. That's not, you know, that's, 30:46 that's not really being too aggressive. So he just said, you've got spray stuff on and give it 48 hours. 30:54 So you really do need to be looking ahead. There's a chance you're wasting your money also. Oh, it could frost on Tuesday. 31:00 Here it is, Sunday morning, I'm gonna go ahead and run and and spray this on. And it doesn't materialize. Probably worth it. 31:09 Uh, we like to be proactive. We wanna be out there 72 to 48 hours ahead of adverse weather to protect that plant. 31:20 We, we've worked with these products long enough. We know their track record, so we've got a good peace of mind. 31:27 Uh, the first time it really became evident with this on Shield X was over 20 years ago and it was on winter wheat and it was the next county over. 31:38 And, uh, we were farming across from a neighbor. And this is, it was kind of ironic how it worked out. We both were planting winter wheat the same day in the fall. 31:48 We were both spraying in the next spring at the same time. We could see each other with our sprayers. 31:56 And uh, we knew there was a risk of late season frost. So we added Shield X in and the neighbor did not, he didn't know what it was. 32:06 And we both actually pulled in with our combines at the same time, and it did freeze 32:13 as the wheat was heading within the next week. It froze hard. Mm-Hmm. I mean, things looked ugly. We pulled in with our combines 32:22 and we were cutting 45 bushel wheat. Yeah, we took a kick, but we had a crop. The neighbor, he pulled in at the same time, 32:30 they left an hour and a half later, there was no wheat in their field. They had bare heads. So that's when it was a light bulb 32:38 really connected with us. And we've never looked back When thing about this Damon. So I put that out there. 32:45 I spent that money, you know, you said it could be wasted. What's the best thing that could have happened 32:49 after I spent that money? The weather gets better and it doesn't, That it not frost at all. 32:54 Yeah. You see what I'm saying? So, so I I would've been absolutely beside myself because it didn't frost, even though I put that out there, 33:03 it s**t like, like Lee said, it's just thinking ahead. And So, uh, I I think we make the mistake. 33:12 I think we make the mistake as growers or just basically humans. And the only we, we believe that the only stress 33:19 that's there is what we could see. Right? So even though you're putting that, even though Matt made that application, or Lee 33:26 and I might make that application, and then the frost doesn't come, that money's not wasted. 'cause their stress going on out there that you can't see. 33:34 And as inexpensive as these products are, I'd be shocked if you don't have an ROI, at least a break even. 33:40 Worst case scenario, what's Matt talking about right now? He, so Matt put those products on, 33:45 they've got a three week residual now he's talking about some days of in the forties in the rain. 33:50 That's a stressful situation for him too. I promise you that that application is gonna pay him off here more than once. 33:57 It it, it helped him survive the frost and now it's gonna help him come through this wet weather even better. 34:03 That, that, that application is absolutely not wasted. Just because you cannot see frost, you've gotta get away from the mindset of, 34:10 if I can't see that doesn't exist. Everybody's nodding their head. In case you're listening to this audio, uh, 34:16 on the video right now, everybody's nodding their head. I think this is a neat topic because it came up and then I I made you guys cover it, but frost equals stress 34:26 and stress mitigation is really what all you, everything you've talked about is, is really stress mitigation. 34:33 Yes. Well, and yes, Kelly's point, Kelly's point. You, you can look at me right now in this video. Can you tell if I've got heart disease? 34:41 Exactly. That the plant's the same way plants and humans are so close. It's, you know, that plant may have some internal problems 34:48 that you don't, you definitely are not gonna see from the vigil. He, you know, uh, Damien, you know, 34:53 when I made the statement that, uh, that Lee was playing chess, we were playing checkers, is when Lee was telling Chad 34:59 and I that when the plant is under heat stress, it emits the hormone ethylene two weeks before it's visual to the naked eye. 35:06 He wanted to invent an ethylene sniffer so he knew when it started doing it, we can put the products out sooner. 35:12 So two weeks before you can see the heat stress of the naked eye, the plant is already been Hormones. It's already experiencing stress. 35:18 It's already experiencing stress by the time you see It too. So two things. One that shows you how Lee, 35:22 you wanna talk about over your head. Lee wants to sniff ethylene and Jack, Jack just, that's, that's, that's 35:29 where the chest versus Checkers thing came from. But you, it's not visual to the naked eye and the plan is under stress two weeks ahead of time. 35:36 Yeah, Lee? Um, I think it's, uh, we've about covered this. I I mean, we talked about the products, 35:40 talked about the s in furrow is, uh, your best option. And if you don't have, if you're not set to do in furrow, uh, products like accomplish max, a couple of the others 35:48 that were mentioned, uh, then you can still handle it fully early. Um, if the plant's not up. 35:54 In other words, there's no fully doesn't absorb unless the plant is up. If the plant's not up, you don't need to do nothing 35:59 because you have no risk of frost damage until the plant is emerged. Am I right? 36:04 Yeah. Yeah. But we still want to fortify that plant in furrow. We do because you get cold enough temps the cold 36:15 can penetrate down. Uh, we've seen it, uh, burn the spike off of corn if we don't, if we're not proactive, you 36:22 Know, that's what I was wondering. So if you, because a lot of farmers I think are gonna be really, 36:27 again, they're not doing anything wrong. They're just gonna say, Hey, let's go a little earlier because the way the spring is, 36:31 and then we might have that, that return of winter, you know, late April, may, whatever it should be. And if the plant's not emerged, if it's in the ground, 36:40 it's been in long enough, you went out and did a dig, you'd be like, it's sprouted. It's, it's not, it's not above the ground yet they're still, 36:46 frost can still hurt you even if the plant's not an inch, two inches, three inches. Mm-Hmm. And so it, somebody take 36:52 that Lee, you're nodding your head. Uh, well, it's going to be hurting the plant's metabolic processes. 36:58 It's gonna be holding it back. It's not starting out of the gate. Right. Uh, like going back to 37:03 what Kelly said about seeing these visible, you know, stresses hitting a plant. Yeah. Every time you see visible 37:10 stresses hitting your plant, if it's to that point, it's taking money outta your pocket. Can I put something on a field 37:18 that I didn't have in furrow? My plants are in the ground. They're sprout. They're, they're, they're rooting, they're, 37:23 they're, they're sprouting. They're not through the, they're not able to take a foliar yet. 37:27 They're just, they're just somewhere between breaking the ground and not, can I put something on that'll help them 37:32 or is it not necessary? Sounds like it is necessary. Uh, I would be an advocate of running an in furrow program because you've exposed yourself, you're to the point. 37:43 You can't do an early foliar Yeah. And you didn't do an in furrow. You're kind at the mercy of mother nature. So that's 37:50 The case. You could treat The seed, the seed, you could, you could do a seed treatment with mega grow. 37:54 True. Absolutely. There you go. Kelly Scott. So the answer, the answer option is if you don't have in furrow and you think your frost problem is going 38:03 to happen when the plant is, when the seed is in the ground, but not yet, you know, not, 38:09 It's just barely spiking through is what you're Saying. If to take a foliar, it needs 38:12 to be a couple inches tall right. To absorb, uh, maybe not a couple inches tall, but it needs to be out of the ground 38:18 with some leaves exposed. Yeah. Right. Otherwise you can't take a foliar. So then the answer is do a seed treatment. 38:23 So a non inro person, you and Matt both say, okay, do you do that in your later stuff, Matt? 38:29 Do what Now? You do a seed treatment on your, even on your later planted stuff. Yes. I I don't plant a single seed without 38:34 A, a seed treatment on it of some sort. Now there's different types of seed treatments you can put on, 38:39 but I'm gonna have a fungicide and a fungicide on my seed treatment regardless. Awesome. All right. 38:45 Uh, going around the horn here, this has been a great topic and maybe I'm just partial to it 38:49 because I was so fascinated by it. All right. I admit, um, frost lessons to limit freeze loss going around the horn here. 38:57 Uh, you, you're the one that's closest to it. Matt, what's your lesson? Uh, just pay attention. 39:03 I mean, what I'm doing with, with, with what I'm doing now is a hundred percent research. You know, find that window that, that you're out of a, 39:12 a, a normal frost. And then just try to stay in that window. Kelly, anything else? Closing, closing. 39:20 You know, I, last, last tip, thought I would be an advocate for the INFERRAL program and running, like, you know, 39:26 we talked about accomplished Maxs mega growth, things like that. Every time I go across the field, 39:31 we're gonna spray Terramar Shield X, you know, a different hormone package. The, the Corteva biological products, things like 39:39 that are the ones we're starting to work with now because we can, again, we cannot see the stress when we're, you know, this, this podcast is speci 39:46 specifically about frost. So that might mean an extra application to save it if you're pushing the envelope early 39:53 or if there's a unusual late season one. But this isn't, we've invested all this money. The land, the inputs, margins are tight. 40:01 You've got to go out there and make this extra pass at times protect, to protect everything else you've got. 40:06 And it's a very minimal expense to protect the, to protect the whole gross margin. Lee, you gotta go last as are Lee Kasparov 40:17 luber, by the way, that was the greatest checker chess player I think of all time. The one that took on the, the computer from IBM. Anyway, Mr. 40:24 Kasparov, what do you got? Uh, I guess the way we look at it is, uh, you've got a crop out there. 40:33 You're in the business of farming and you wanna raise the best crop you can. We wanna mis minimize those stresses. 40:39 And frost is not gonna happen every year. But what we're ta what we've talked about today are all low cost options. 40:47 You're, you're a very small investment with really high ROI, uh, it can be the reason that, uh, you don't have to go back 40:55 and replant your crop a month too late. I mean, uh, these small investments can give you huge dividends, huge payoff. 41:04 Yeah. But you gotta be proactive. You've gotta acknowledge like, Hey, this is coming. I'll, I'll go spend a few bucks an acre to protect myself. 41:14 Minimize the damage. It can, it can be a make or break in your crop. Everybody on here has fire 41:20 insurance on their house, right? Yep. How many fires do you had in your house? Yep. None. Right? It's 41:26 The same. It's the same principle. Got it. All right. So, uh, frost lessons to limit your freeze loss. We talked about cold survivability 41:34 talked about in furrow program. Is, is, is key. If you don't have an in furrow program, that doesn't mean you're sunk. 41:39 You can do a seed treatment, which as Kelly pointed out, and they all agreed on that. And then you can know, you can also do in, 41:44 you can do foliar stuff so you can really cover your bases. These are low cost options. It's insurance. 41:48 We just heard that. And again, if you're saying, you know what, I just won't push you envelope, that's fine. 41:52 You might, you might take a little yield drag on that by going out later. But the thing about a year like this, 41:57 and it is shaping up to that kind of a year, and I'm not a weather guy, but you just heard from these guys, is not unreasonable 42:03 that you're gonna get out a little earlier because of the type of year we've already had, generally throughout most 42:07 of North America being trending warmer. They didn't even have much of a freeze line in the prairie provinces. 42:13 They weren't down three feet like they were. Are they six inches ice fishermen were off the lakes by early February in Minnesota. 42:20 I was there. Okay. So what happens if the return of winter happens in say, about three, four weeks into after your stuff is already planted? 42:28 And that's why this is such an applicable topic, especially this year. So thanks for joining us. Lee Luber sometimes know 42:34 as Kasparov, uh, Kelly Garrett and the guy that brought this topic up. Matt Miles, thank you very much for being here. 42:40 Again, you should join Extreme Ag Farm. If you are not already a member of just seven $50 a year, you get access to these guys for question answer platforms. 42:47 You get special deals from our business partners, and also you get trial data at the end of the year to find out exactly what happened on these guys farms. 42:54 Not that we don't share a bunch of it already right here. So anyway, thanks for being here. 42:57 So next time, I'm Damien Mason. This is extreme Ice Cutting the curve. That's a wrap for this episode of Cutting the Curve. 43:03 Make sure to check out Extreme Ag Farm for more great content to help you squeeze more profit out of your farming operation. 43:10 Cutting the curve is brought to you by cloth where machines aren't just made, they're made for more. Visit cloth.com 43:18 and start cutting your curve with cutting edge equipment.